Thomas, Saying 15

Thursday, May 23, 2019

10:25 p.m. Saying 15:

Jesus said: When you see someone not born from a woman, prostrate yourselves and worship him; he is your father.

Certainly cryptic enough. And it seems to me maybe that quotation I cited the other day was not from Jung, though that’s what the guys said. But I wouldn’t know where to find it.

Friday, May 24, 2019

5:20 a.m. I guess I’m ready if you are. I can’t make much of this one, offhand. (Though, I keep saying that, and you do keep making sense of them.) So –?

The preceding sayings?

Getting hard to summarize them. Why don’t you do it?

Remember the aim: to clarify the human condition in light of 3D/non-3D interactions. Who are you, really? What are your origins, limitations, and possibilities? This one says, here is another clue, one you would be unlikely to come to without assistance.

How can someone be not born from a woman?

Either it is a metaphor, or it describes something unknown to us. I suppose I have read somewhere one of those irritatingly cryptic sayings of one of my contemporaries or near-contemporaries saying there are two ways to enter this life, and one is through the female body – and that is all it said, leaving the impression that he could say more if he chose (only he didn’t choose) – or that he was a fraud. But to have Jesus recorded as saying it, well, his message was to live with integrity, so if in anything he was to lie or even to pretend, his authority would collapse.

Meaning, you are forced to assume this saying means something, whether or not you can figure it out.

That’s about it. As you say, how can anyone be not born from a woman?

Look, though, at the whole statement at once, not one element at a time. How can he be your father? Why should you worship him?

It’s all Greek to me. Again, I get the feeling that you don’t know either.

At any rate, you are clear that you do not.

Oh yes.

And if we do not know, our authority falls to the ground, as we are postulated to know everything.

Well that’s still my assumption, on a practical level, yes.

Go rest a while, and return to this.

While you look something up?

If you wish to think of it that way.

It isn’t like you haven’t known for hours what this saying is.

Go rest.

7:30 a.m. So I rested, I slept, dreamed. I’m willing to go at it again, but without a lot of expectation. How can someone be not born from woman? I say “someone,” but it can only be a man, if we are to recognize him as our “father.” So, what is it about, really?

You know from other scriptures that Jesus talked of being born again, of water and the spirit.

Yes, that one always puzzled his contemporaries, his listeners.

Later it became widely understood to mean, attaining a new conscious life, a new beginning, one might say.

Can’t say as I remember hearing it described that way.

Well, look at it.

All right. Funny, the movie “Limitless” comes into mind.

It is a very good metaphor. Eddie Morra lives in a different world once he totally absorbs the increase in perception and cognitive ability. Now he has superhuman abilities, as it were. It is only an analogy, but it does have its instructive aspects. What Jesus was offering, you will recall, was life more abundantly.

So if we meet someone who has become so fundamentally transformed, so awakened and realized, we are to bow low and consider him our father?

Look behind the human face to the non-3D reality being addressed.

Hmm. Meaning, bow low to the greater being from which we sprang, and not to the person expressing it?

Doesn’t that make greater sense?

I don’t see the advantage of confusing that higher being with the 3D person through whom it expresses.

The point is that then there isn’t a difference between them; that the 3D person and the greater being it expresses are one.

“I and my father re one.”

Exactly.

Well, that is an interesting take on it. I can’t very well argue with it, given that I couldn’t come up with anything at all. Now tell me, why couldn’t we get this at 5:30 in the morning? It isn’t like that was a long time ago. It isn’t like coffee was involved, since I’ve given it up at least temporarily. It isn’t for the sake of the little dreams I had, forgotten now but no big deal even at the time. What is the difference?

We have told you that different moments have different connective possibilities. What is available at one moment may not be available at another moment.

In this case, I can’t see why. The connections you just provided are long familiar to me in other contexts, and you didn’t have to lead me to them by a process of reasoning or of association. So how did time enter into it?

That is going to have to remain one of life’s mysteries.

Seriously?

We never set up to explain everything. Let’s stick to the point.

Well, all I can say is, I’ll be damned.

You won’t, however. Now listen, there is no need for you to begin with another saying merely because this is short. Send it out, and then do other things.

Yes, I think I will. Thanks. Maybe someday you’ll enter into how lapse of time entered into this. Till next time.

 

10 thoughts on “Thomas, Saying 15

  1. “. . . meaning the 3D person and the greater being that it expresses are one.” So, in him we see truth and how to live it. Thanks, Frank.

  2. In case anyone neded a “second” to what Frank wrote, back in 2013 I had read parts of the Book of Thomas and I blogged about it. This is what I wrote for saying 15:

    “This is the source other than flesh: you as a soul/entity. You as a soul is the “father” or “God” (since we as a soul are portions of All That Is), and “you”, the personality living life in the flesh, is the creation of the soul. You and the soul are one, but “you” are in the flesh, just as Jesus was “God” in flesh. This is why Jesus was called a blasphemer, and why people who accepted this message of their own godliness were considered heretics. Unless you recognize your origin as that without a mother, you will not recognize yourself as spirit.”

    There is a general theme that Jesus is trying to convey: you are God in flesh.

    1. This sentence: “Unless you recognize your origin as that without a mother, you will not recognize yourself as spirit,” had the most resonance for me about this question. Thanks, Simon.

  3. It isn’t for the sake of the little dreams I had … Why not? It’s very clear that the ‘state’ of my consciousness greatly affects what guidance can ‘get through’ to me. Dreams, remembered or not, are one major way ‘we’ change me.

    For me “When you see someone not born from a woman, prostrate yourselves and worship him; he is your father.” becomes
    ‘When you become aware of your non-physical ‘self’, work to pay attention and increase that awareness; this is the ‘self’ you come from and are one with.’
    Jim

  4. Maybe by recognizing those who are closer to an alignment between their 3D selves and their divine selves will open us to aligning closer to ours and edge us further along the path to seeing the divine in all. Through such others who have a closer alignment, we can experience directly what such alignment can be and move in that direction.

    As an example, I know a woman who is working on a huge government grant for renewable energy in our community. She is unassuming and down to earth. In conversations with her, when she described her purpose and her mission for the people and the land, I felt such an energetic high. It was like a holy space opened up around us in which the creative principle was in action, with the purest selfless intentions and unlimited possibilities.

    I am also reminded of an Indian guru, Anandi Ma, who would go into the samadhi state and she would touch people on their foreheads. The peace from one of her touches could resonate with me for days.

    Maybe this relates back to saying 13 where Jesus says to Thomas: I am not your teacher; you have drunk from and become intoxicated from the bubbling water that I poured out. Since Jesus had already recognized Thomas as having aligned his 3-D self with his God-self, it was a suggestion for the other apostles to take a more open non-biased look at Thomas.

    1. Coming from a Christian background myself, it was easy to think that people needed to be this or that. That’s why Christians needed to “share the good news”. I think saying 14 reminds us that we don’t have to be this or that. Instead, be yourself. If that means in this lifetime, you are not “enlightened”, then that is the perfect you because your non-3D has another version of you that is highly enlightened. The one big misunderstanding about the human experience is that we’re creating “heaven on Earth” as if there is no polarity/duality. That is not the case. Heaven on Earth, to me, means everything is permissible and no one is judged. That means true unconditional love exists, not that all is “positive” oriented.

  5. Re: It’s all Greek to me. Again, I get the feeling that you don’t know either.
    At any rate, you are clear that you do not.
    Oh yes.
    And if we do not know, our authority falls to the ground, as we are postulated to know everything.
    Well that’s still my assumption, on a practical level, yes.
    Go rest a while, and return to this.
    While you look something up?

    The vibe I get from you in this interaction, Frank, is being a bit frustrated which resulted in being oppositional to a certain extent. It doesn’t surprise me that they suggested a rest and coming back later.

    What I have noticed in my own relations with non-3D is that if I begin to get at all demanding that they “perform” for me, they don’t respond to that. The “dog and pony show” idea. Not the phone line that yields the results. They usually suggest I let it go for the day or end the conversation for now. So their response to you had a familiar ring for me. Sigh… luckily, they don’t seem to mind. One of the nice things about interacting with those who have unconditional love. :–)

    1. I think you’re reading into this sequence something that isn’t there on my end, though apparently it reminds you of your own experiences. It wasn’t a case of my demanding something (THAT would get me a long way!) nor of my being frustrated. Rather, it’s closer to “i’m going to be totally open with you as to what i’m feeling,” which has always worked well between me and them. Usually, or let’s say frequently, they monitor my energy level, and say, “that’s enough for the oment,” or, “Go rest now and come back to this another time.” IT isn’t like they’re giving me a time out!

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