[I decided that the Monroe free-flow 27 tape wasn’t necessary.]
Rita Warren: Not going to use the sound tonight?
F: Let’s try without it.
R: All right. In that case, just get very relaxed and move yourself into a very comfortable state, to the point where you’re able to move your conscious mind out of the way a bit so that we can speak directly to the gentlemen upstairs. If you want to do some resonant tuning you can do that….
F: Are we rolling?
R: Yes we are. So this is an experiment tonight, we’re trying without your listening to the Hemi-Sync, and without doing the resonant tuning, but you’re doing a good job of being very relaxed and willing to let the gentlemen upstairs come through
F: They always come through. I don’t need a lot of preparation
R: I had a leftover from one of our earlier sessions when we were talking about their way of perceiving things and our way of perceiving things. I have these experiences — and I think a lot of folks do — of having awareness of some other energies in our field that we catch out of the corner of our eye, and when we turn and take a closer look, there seems to be nothing there. But I have had the feeling that those are other energies operating on an earth plane but not in ordinary physical dimensions. Do you have some comments on that?
F: Well, yes, we would say two or three things are going on. What you see is seen through filters, and the filters are transparent, so it’s hard for you to realize that there ARE filters. Not [just] you, but everyone. And seeing out of the corner of your eye, both metaphorically and literally, may be the only way that you can see something that your filter says doesn’t exist. And then as you look at it more closely, your filter will totally close it out. But that can be overcome simply–but not necessarily easily –by informing all levels of your being that you wish to move outside those filters, that you wish to remove them. You need to reassure other parts of yourself that it’s safe to remove the filters and that it will be interesting to do so.
This is basic shamanism, as you would call it. Once you’ve done that, there are two other things going on. One is that your range of frequency varies from day to day, from moment to moment and sometimes as your frequency extends a little bit it would be easier for you to see something that you wouldn’t ordinarily see. So, one, there’s the filter that’s partly blocking it out. Two, you have to be at the right resonance to see it anyway. And the third is “I don’t really believe in this, so it’s obviously not there, so I’m not seeing it,” which prevents the vast majority of people from seeing these things.
R: I’m not sure I understood that third point.
F: The third one doesn’t particularly apply to you as an individual, but it’s a sort of a complement to the filter. The filter is a totally unconscious way of not seeing things, of not bringing in data. But the third is a conscious, rational, logical “they don’t exist, so I’m not seeing them.”
R: Oh, I see. Mm-hmm. And the energies that we’re perceiving that way, does this suggest that there are others operating in this physical earth plane in some way but not visible to us living lives as we live them?
F: Well, yes, but the problem is that the spatial analogy is almost unbreakable. There’s only one “here” and it’s as here for Focus 27 as it is for focus 3 as it is for focus one. You see? There isn’t any other “there,” so yes, all the various frequencies are here, and as you move your receiving set you perceive different ones — filters and other things allowing, of course. All of focus 23 is right here. Focus 27 is right here. There’s not another “here” to be, in a way.
R: Okay, well then in our physical bodies, we have a civilization, in which we see each other and interact in certain ways. I’m asking if there’s another such body of energies working in a similar way but unavailable to us.
F: From your point of view, there are many others. From our point of view, they’re slightly different variants of the same overall energy. So – looking at it from your point of view, there are many many many many many– not just Another but an infinite number of others. If vibrations had steps, every step is filled.
R: And are these groups of energies operating just at different vibrational levels? Is that why there isn’t this kind of contact?
F: The contact that there is is perceived by you as being separate, and so sometimes it could be ghosts, or sometimes fairies or different spirits or earth spirits or energies or – or – or um [I don’t quite know what they mean. It’s like affinity, but that doesn’t make sense in context.] It’s [only] an analogy, but it is an analogy. Some frequencies resonate to yours, and in those there can be interaction. And on your end the interaction might be perceived as proceeding from your own mind, rather than as something that comes to you. Ideas, for instance, are actually the interaction of your own energy system with other energy systems. This is one reason why you can have an idea, and if you don’t grasp it, it goes away, and it might be a long time before it’s ever within grasp again — because it’s an interaction between two things. You wouldn’t think of an idea as another energy system, but it’s the product of one.
R: And when we are in our ordinary thinking process, when one idea leads to another, this is again something that we’re not creating but we’re just picking up something that is there and that we become aware of or not….
F: Your thinking process is more like choosing. You’re not passive, but your part is more like choosing than like constructing. And your various filters make it impossible for you to think certain things.
R: Makes it impossible for us to think certain things? So what is it that’s limiting us? Just our ability to choose alternatives?
F: Well, both as a civilization and as a family and as a individual yourself, which means a collection of things, there are agreed-upon understandings of the way the world is, and those understandings make possible a common language, and in making possible a common language, they at the same time and therefore make impossible certain other perceptions. If you are going to agree that green is green, it makes it impossible to agree that green is sound, you see? Or that green is the Lone Ranger. Nonsensical things are examples of things that you can’t think, that don’t make any sense. They are not even wrong, they’re just self-evidently nonsense.
R: And these agreements that we’ve made to use in common – does this seem like the history of our language development?
F: Well, we would just say it’s the inevitable result of living in a limited time-space. You don’t really have any other way that you can live, because the infinitude of reality is too great. You couldn’t live, you have to pare it down to a manageable subset. That’s the best we can do with that. Now, different civilizations have different subsets, and they overlap but some of them are radically different. That’s one reason for different civilizations.
R: Now are you talking about here differences in civilizations that exist at one time on the earth.
F: Well, at one time, at many times, sure. In a way you could look at it as a larger view of the difference between what seem to you to be individuals on the earth. Each of you as individuals lives different lives, comes up with different viewpoints, and you have therefore constructed different things. Well, the same thing happens on larger and larger scales.
R: Mm-hmm. Okay, I was thinking now of moving on to another subject, unless there’s something else that you’d like to say on this topic that we’ve been on.
F: Well, our sense is that you understood it very well.
R: I want to move to the health and healing area, and I’d like to talk about the health issue first. I’d like to ask the extent to which our physical health is under our own mental control.
F: We smile. Now whyever would that question come up. [They laugh.] Well, we hate to be pedantic, but there’s no alternative here. It depends on what you mean by all of those definitions: “we,” “control,” “physical”—
R: Okay, well some of those I can clear up. I mean, “we” as human beings and “physical health” just simply mean the comfortable and efficient operating human body, and “mental control,” well, it feels to me like that’s obvious.
F: Well, let’s go back over the definitions, and we’ll show why.
F: You as human beings, of course. But what are you as a human being? How many levels? If you mean what kind of control do we have as conscious, “Downstairs” individuals, it’s an entirely different question from what kind of control do we have to the extent that we are at a larger and larger integration with other parts of ourselves. You see, the question determines the answer, really. A person who is not in touch with their own unconscious mind and not in touch with the intuitive perceiver – what you call the right brain – in other words, a person who is logic-oriented and sense-driven, has only the most indirect control over their own health. They really are constrained to do very little other than the physical things that will have a physical result and at best probably can hold a positive attitude. There’s not much else they can do. Their best bet is to stay out of the way and let the automatic mechanisms of the body do the best they can. And the best way to stay out of the way is to maintain a cheerful attitude and follow their sensible rules, and if they have a physical problem, deal with it in physical terms. Because they have such a limited tool chest.
Now, someone who is still dealing only Downstairs, but is highly intuitive, will expand their tool chest; they will have the ability to know what they should do, what they should eat, how they should be, what they’re doing to harm or help their health, and they will be able to form habits and they’ll be able to live in a sensible way. There’ll be no conflict between their intuitions and their habits. So at that level, they’ll have a little bigger tool chest, because they won’t get sick as often. They’ll have everything the other one had, and it’ll look like they’re always fortunate. They’ll be “lucky.”
Now, to go a little higher level than that, a person who has integrated the intuition and the logic, they’re living in a sensible way but they’re living in an intuitive way and following it, and beyond that have become aware of other things, of other modalities as they say — energy body work, for instance. They’ll be able to do everything that the second one did, but they’ll be able to do more as well, because they will be moving their control to another level of being, and as Frank always says, they’ll be able to load the dice. They will be able to assist their own unconscious processes by focusing them. And they’ll say – and you’ve done it many times – “you need some healing energy here.” They may not know how to do it exactly, but they don’t need to know how to do it; they know how to direct it, and that’s all that’s needed.
Then, next level up after that is more conscious control of more of the automatic mechanism. And then beyond that is greater, wider, deeper, surer, more constant connection with what you call Upstairs, and it’s as though it puts control of the health in the hands of a wiser, more far-seeing part of the person. Just as, when you do energy work, you’re running the energy through yourself and helping heal yourself while you’re helping someone else heal. That’s what’s going on there. The ultimate is, Jesus said, “I and the father are one,” and what he meant was, “that energy is coming right through me.” Flowing through, and without the distinction, it gives the ability to raise from the dead. Literally.
Now, we know that’s a long answer, but it’s the real answer.
R: Mm-hmm. As more and more of the control is given over to the higher energies, the system I guess just seems more automatic, in terms of being able to maintain a healthy state. But it is an automatic state in that one has turned over that kind of control to the higher self or however one visualizes it?
F: When we say turn it over, it’s not exactly the same thing as throwing up your hands; it’s more like being a steward of larger energies. The greater energies are there to be used and you are able to channel them more, because before you have the access to the wider energies, there’s nothing for you to use. You know, it’s kept out of your hands, as you keep sharp instruments out of the hands of children. So as more energies become available to you, you’re still the one using them. However, what you said is not wrong. It is true that a lot of it seems more automatic. We would, however, caution you that the purpose of life is not necessarily the avoidance of illness. Illness or disease or accidents (so-called) are not necessarily failures, they are, as Jules Verne used to say, incidents, not accidents. They may have their own purpose.
R: So one brought some physical difficulties into this lifetime for certain purposes.
F: Well, you could look at it like this. You have physical and mental legacies from where you’ve been before. And that’s the whole purpose of it [physical life], of course, is to accumulate those legacies. You have mental predispositions, you have talents, you have innate things that you know, because you’ve been there and done those. A concomitant of that which cannot really be divorced from it is, some of those are injuries. Injuries can be fixed at any time. They’re not necessarily brought in as lessons so much as they’re brought in because this is a time that they can be dealt with, perhaps. If at any given lifetime you were to bring in all of the physical disabilities, all of the mental problems, all of the emotional hurts, all of the lessons to be learned — [laughs] you couldn’t live!
R: Mm-hmm. It would overwhelm you.
F: It would overwhelm you. So what happens is, as a given lifetime is planned, certain things seem to go together. “Well, she can work on this, this, this and this.” “All right, in that case, she can also do this, this, this and this.” “Well, do you want to do this as well?” “Well, maybe that one. Maybe this too.” So there can be some physical things, some emotional things, some mental things. And many of those will be tied together, because it is after all one organism. But it’s always selected before you come in; you couldn’t deal with all of them. Therefore, you could look at all of your problems as opportunities. We know it’s a cliché, but – they really are. They’re only here because you are capable of dealing with them, at least theoretically. Now, by your wrong choices, you might make it impossible to deal with them, but, you know, “wrong” choices still lead somewhere, so it’s–
R: We also have what seem like genetic disorders, that come to various members of the same family, or whatever.
F: Well, you’re born into a family that offers you that opportunity. You will remember that members of those families inexplicably skip those tendencies, too. Those members didn’t need it.
You might not think of it, but in the shaping of your lives, a lot of compromise goes on, and you say, “well, you know, we can do this, this and this”; “well, but if we do that, the problem is, we have to accept this.” And we say “well, that’s worth it because it’s such an advantageous thing otherwise.” You know? So you might wind up in a family that has a disability that really doesn’t really impact you one way or the other – that is, it isn’t important to you, but it comes with the territory? And the rest of the territory is important enough to do that. So just for the sake of completeness, that’s a sort of a rogue factor, you might say. There’s always a little chaos inside the pattern. [laughs]
R: Well, I’m not sure if I understood that. In order to join a certain family you might decide to put up with some of the deficiencies that come with that family? And some other aspects of it that would genetically be present.
F: Yes, that’s a way of looking at it. Now, they may not be physical, they might be attitudinal, they might be emotional, they might be anything. But, you’re not going to find a perfect situation. Well, every situation can be considered perfect but sometimes the perfection has to be looked at carefully [chuckles] In other words–
R: Not necessarily obvious.
F: Well, it isn’t necessarily what you might have chosen had everything else been shaped that way, but then “since it’s there, okay, we’ll use this and we can use this to develop patience,” or something else, you know.
R: Why is that there are inherently some of those difficulties there?
F: Physical difficulties?
R: Either kind, physical or mental or attitudinal or whatever. When a person is choosing a lifetime why not make everything perfect? Or as perfect as possible?
F: Well, you could say that it is, given that the purpose of the lifetime is to exercise your muscles and choose. It’s the old analogy of the baby bird coming out of the egg: If it didn’t have to struggle to get out of the egg, it couldn’t develop the muscles it needed to fly. The whole purpose of being in space-time is to have delayed consequences. And it’s true – and we really do understand this; we really do understand it. We know what pain is, and what suffering is, from your point of view. But – well, they’re just so useful. To you. Which means to us, but it means to you, too.
R: So that we don’t have to think of it in terms of learning lessons, necessarily. Or is that a summary of it?
F: [pause] Well, in your society right now, we think the whole school thing is way overdone. It isn’t so much about learning lessons as it is making choices and becoming what you become by the choices that you make. Now, if you make choices, you’re going to learn, but the learning is the byproduct, not the making choices. The making choices is the product. Is the becoming, you know. The fashioning. We would say actually that it is a function of your overeducated, that they see everything in terms of learning and schools.
It’s not the learning so much as the making choices. It’s the becoming what you become. Your life itself – apart from any lessons or any morals or any retroactive retrospection, looking at it and saying “I did well here, I did badly there” – regardless of any of that, your life itself is the gift you bring us, because that’s your shaping. If a child sits down and colors a picture, and gives it to the parent, the picture is what she gives to the parent. It’s not a lesson, to the child. Now the child may learn something, making the picture, but the picture is the picture. Your lives are the gift.
It’s true, you can’t very well live without learning. And you wouldn’t want to. And you can’t live long enough and thoughtfully enough without gaining in wisdom. But it isn’t the end result of gaining wisdom that’s the important part; the end result is the living. A person who lives as a drunk and dies in the gutter has still created a picture.
We know that’s hard —
R: I like that. Well now, my original questions had to do with physical health. I assume all those things that you’ve said apply equally well to mental health. Emotional health?
F: It’s hard for us to see what you mean by mental health. We see well enough what you mean by it, your way, but look at it for a moment from our point of view. [pause] To us, your concept of lack of mental health implies someone whose mind is malfunctioning. But – other than a physical malfunction, a brain malfunction, it really looks to us like what you call mental ill-health is people who don’t do what you want them to do. People who scare you because they’re not predictable. People who live in such a different world that it’s hard for you to adjust. And impossible for them to adjust.
So take Alzheimer’s, for example, since that’s on your mind. That to you is a mental health thing that’s caused by physical health. Or, well, regardless of cause, but that’s how it looks. But you only see it from the point of view of a person looking at another person. You can’t, of course, see it from the point of view of – of – how shall we say it? You’re all tentacles on one octopus, so to speak. It’s not a tragedy. It’s not a malfunction. It’s a series of choices and an activity, let’s say. It’s not a deformed picture, any more than a person who dies of cancer is; it’s just a picture.
R: Yet, when I think about mental health, I broaden that concept to include things like the ways in which childhood experiences affect the rest of a person’s life in negative ways, for example. Childhood events that cause a grownup to always choose the wrong marital partner, or always to be in a state of anxiety, or —
F: And why do you suppose those events happened and had those effects, when someone else who had the identical experience – as close as you could get – would not have that effect. In other words, we’re gently saying that’s not an accident, that’s what the person had set up, for a reason. That lifetime of what seemed like dysfunction could be looked at as a mold, and the mold constrains them in certain ways, so that they’ll come back against the same situation again and again and again, and have to choose. Now there is learning in that, but we would say it’s the choice and not the learning that’s the important part there.
The learning is important in that it helps them to choose, let’s put it that way. So a person who spends an entire lifetime in total frustration in a certain direction may come out of the lifetime extremely benefited. We can give you an example. Edgar Cayce lived his life under very severe constraints, which purified him and kept him from the temptations of misusing gifts that, misused, would have only damaged him. The picture that he chose to paint was painted against a background carefully chosen to help him paint it.
Now, that’s somewhat different. You’re talking there of poverty and anxiety and depression, but still, again, what looks to you like mental problems looks to us like a person adapting as best they can to tangible and intangible circumstances.
R: I think part of the picture for me has been that one sees similarities in certain childhood crises or certain childhood patterns seem to typically be worked out in the same way by adults. So that it seems not – well, there’s no reason why the matter of choice couldn’t still be in there, but there seem to be typical choices for certain patterns of response. And —
F: Are you suggesting that the patterns are beyond their control?
R: I don’t believe that they are without choice points, there, somehow. It may be inevitable that there is some disruption in adulthood that follows, or some discomfort in adulthood that follows from childhood patterns.
F: They may lead a life of total frustration. Seemingly.
R: Yeah. But you’re saying that there’s meaning in that.
F: Well, we could go into that a little, if you wish.
R: All right.
F: Given that you’re here to create a flower, or a picture, it can’t be without meaning. Nothing can be without meaning. This is one deeper sense in which the expression that “all paths are good” can be seen. It doesn’t really matter what the final picture looks like. To a large degree, what matters is that the picture is painted. And if 999 out of a thousand paintings are failures, so called, they’re still painted. And it’s better to paint than not to paint. It’s better to – [chuckle] we’ve been lured into a really terrible analogy, because it’s constrictive, but wait a minute. A better analogy: if you had a thousand leaves of grass in a field, some might be blighted and some might be prematurely brown and some might be broken, or eaten by insects – but it’s still the perfection of a field of grass. And part of that perfection is the very irregularity and the very unpredictability of it. You see? There can’t be a failure in a leaf of grass.
R: So when we have children and we consider their early life experiences to be very important and we try our best to give the child, the person starting out here, as positive a picture as possible to move ahead with, are those unreasonable concerns on our part?
F: Oh not at all. Don’t forget, that child picked that family for that reason, for that concern. Those matters cannot be dealt with except in terms of 3D reality. You know? It’s true that from our point of view, all paths are good. But from your point of view, it is certainly not equally good that the child fall under the school bus or that the child be safe. That’s where a lot of people are going wrong, because they’re sensing that there’s more to life, but it doesn’t negate what’s all around them. You do the best you can in every circumstance, and – anyone’s best is none too good, you know?
R: Why is that?
F: Well, in other words, everyone deserves the very best. So no one’s best can ever be too good for the person. But there’s a limit to your responsibility, because you are a part of a situation in which that child is an equally sentient being, who is there by consent. As you well know.
R: Yes, okay.
F: Now, we’ll say this as well. To the degree that a society cares more deeply about its children, that whole society as a creation is different from a society that treats them as consumables or as indifferent. So, you know, that’s another aspect of the creation thing. The three dimensional care that you as a parent give to your child makes a difference in terms of the color or the flavor, so to speak, of the society, as well as the individual reaction.
R: Yes, and in some ways it seems like things are getting better in that regard. At least, if one looks at the history of child raising – children used to live in much worse circumstances than they do now; that is, being put to work at very early ages; those kind of dimensions that seem to create a lot of unhappiness and health problems.
F: Well, we wish we could agree. We don’t, though. We don’t think there’s much difference. The difference is in the flavor. Chocolate or vanilla is not better than pistachio; just different. We know where you’re going with this. You’re thinking of the children who were basically thrown away in mines and things, and died at age 10 or 15. But we would point out to you your sex industries in your cities. That you’re doing the same thing, but even worse. It’s different, but it’s not “better.” It’s different. And your children of privilege are actually in many ways perhaps the most underprivileged. They are being cut off from their emotional roots. But again, they’re in that situation because that’s the situation they chose. But it depends if you look from up or from down, you know. Three dimension, or from beyond.
That was a very interesting thing; you actually brought us into your framework for a moment there. Quite interesting. You understand? We swung down, so to speak, into your seeing it as individuals. Very interesting.
R: Mm.. I see. As a result of that —
F: Well, we felt emotions! Which is your largest gift. Very interesting.
R: Uh-huh. [laughs, perhaps in perplexity]
F: Well, you see, you mentioned good and bad, better and worse, and we, in thinking about it, encompassed it. We embodied – It’s hard to say. We felt it to the degree that we were it? And our sadness for the children was as if we were here.
R: Ah hah.
F: It’s very interesting! Surprised us, actually.
R: So that you were also thinking in terms of better and worse.
F: Yes, precisely. Well, not thinking, because we’re well capable of thinking it, but we were – we were emotionally thinking it, if that’s not a contradiction. Very interesting. And of course, that’s a major thing we get out of you being there, but we don’t usually do it [inaudible] [they laugh]
R: All right. Well, I appreciate that being brought out to attention.
F: You see, we keep saying, we’re not any different, we’re just in a different place. And we just sort of visited. [chuckles]
[continued next post]